352 OPERA!

352 OPERA!

Young filmmakers are taking over the box office with horror! And we love it.

Also discussed: Obsession, Backrooms, Spider-Noir.

Transcript

[01:00:28:03 - 01:00:28:03]
Speaker 5
 Eric. I

[01:00:28:03 - 01:00:29:09]
Speaker 2
 don't have nightmares about that now.

[01:00:29:09 - 01:00:24:17]
Speaker 5
 We have such sights to show you.

[01:00:31:11 - 01:00:36:15]
Speaker 2
 Strange Eons. Welcome to Strange Eons Radio.

[01:00:36:15 - 01:00:43:12]
Speaker 1
 Sorry, we can go into a few mariners games. My hands are practicing, clapping. The man with the hands

[01:00:43:12 - 01:00:44:14]
Speaker 2
 is Eric Morgred.

[01:00:46:13 - 01:00:48:02]
Speaker 2
 And Vanessa is here.

[01:00:48:02 - 01:00:49:14]
Speaker 3
 Hello. Thanks.

[01:00:49:14 - 01:00:51:20]
Speaker 2
 Sorry, would you like to clap too?

[01:00:51:20 - 01:00:53:19]
Speaker 3
 No, no, I'm good. I'm great. Thank you.

[01:00:53:19 - 01:01:00:15]
Speaker 2
 I am Kelly. Eric, you had a reaction to some reactions lately online.

[01:01:00:15 - 01:01:18:01]
Speaker 1
 The movies of the moment, at least on my social media feeds, I'm sure you are in the same realm, are people talking about obsession in back rooms, which we might be talking about in just a little moment. This is not about the movies themselves. This is about the weirdness and the

[01:01:19:12 - 01:01:28:11]
Speaker 1
 ignorance of some of the internet to say, there's no way anybody this young. One's 20. The guy did back rooms as 20. The other guy's 26.

[01:01:30:16 - 01:01:31:05]
Speaker 1
 How

[01:01:32:06 - 01:01:35:17]
Speaker 1
 old do you think Steven Spielberg is if he was making movies in the 70s?

[01:01:35:17 - 01:01:45:16]
Speaker 3
 Spielberg had been making movies since he was a kid. Back rooms, like, yes, this is his first feature. But I've seen all of the previous content that he did

[01:01:45:16 - 01:01:48:02]
Speaker 1
 on YouTube. He started at like 16 or 15. Yeah, it's

[01:01:48:02 - 01:02:06:15]
Speaker 3
 not like he hasn't been doing stuff. And each one is higher and higher production value, even if they are essential shorts. It's like you can't. Yes, he probably had a team with him who was helping advise him, I'm sure, because it's A24 money. But that doesn't mean it's not his movie in his choices. It's crazy.

[01:02:06:15 - 01:02:10:11]
Speaker 1
 And about how old was Steven Spielberg when he made your favorite film?

[01:02:10:11 - 01:02:13:00]
Speaker 2
 25 years old. When he made Jaws.

[01:02:13:00 - 01:02:22:13]
Speaker 1
 I'm another crazy one. Citizen Kane. Orson Welles was 25. And I'm sure if we went through, we'd find a whole lot of directors who started in their 20s.

[01:02:22:13 - 01:02:38:00]
Speaker 2
 Well, and the guy who did Obsession had had a YouTube series for many years, right? So I think what we're seeing is all these people started making things at a very young age. And then by the time they had their big breakthrough, it looked professional. I am not shocked.

[01:02:38:00 - 01:02:40:02]
Speaker 3
 No, no, it was zero percent.

[01:02:40:02 - 01:02:45:05]
Speaker 2
 So what are they saying? Is it because the movies are too good or they look

[01:02:45:05 - 01:02:53:01]
Speaker 1
 too good? Yeah, they look too good. They look too professional. They don't look like some guy who's been making YouTube videos or and stuff like that. I'm

[01:02:53:01 - 01:02:53:21]
Speaker 4
 like, OK,

[01:02:53:21 - 01:02:58:15]
Speaker 1
 for one, you obviously haven't delved too deep in the stuff that's on YouTube.

[01:02:59:22 - 01:03:02:07]
Speaker 3
 There's some incredible stuff out there. I

[01:03:02:07 - 01:03:23:07]
Speaker 1
 hate quality stuff being made. And I've watched a bunch of the directors Obsession. I've watched a bunch of his shorts now, too. They're really good. Yeah, really good. And like you, I've watched all the back rooms. And although I think they're a little uneven, but that's only because he made with like 40 of them. There's just so many.

[01:03:24:12 - 01:03:33:11]
Speaker 2
 Well, also, we've all attended film festivals where we run into some young kid who has shown up with a movie that you're just like, Jesus Christ, am I even bothering any guys?

[01:03:33:11 - 01:04:01:17]
Speaker 3
 So good. There's a whole film festivals like Nifty in Seattle. Like there's a whole film festival is just for young filmmakers. I think that that sounds like somebody a mix of ignorance of people who have not seen a lot of content and also probably a leftover feeling of A.I. where we're all like, oh, something looks too good to be real or like we're starting to get really skeptical as like a culture. Yeah, I mean, it feels like a little bleed over from that, but

[01:04:01:17 - 01:04:06:15]
Speaker 2
 also maybe a little bit of jealousy. Oh, sure. I know. I've got it from

[01:04:06:15 - 01:04:07:05]
Speaker 3
 filmmakers.

[01:04:07:05 - 01:04:23:00]
Speaker 1
 Absolutely. Damn. I wish I had the I mean, when we were first looking at doing stuff, the gear you had to get was either oh, yeah, cameras. Yeah. Or you had to get money for film. Yeah. Yeah. Well,

[01:04:23:00 - 01:04:27:02]
Speaker 2
 you can shoot this back in 1912 that was all that was available to us.

[01:04:27:02 - 01:04:31:17]
Speaker 3
 I mean, I had the benefit of mini TV tapes. So let me tell you,

[01:04:31:17 - 01:04:32:06]
Speaker 1
 yeah, there you

[01:04:32:06 - 01:04:36:22]
Speaker 3
 go. A whole world of difference. The tapes were from this into this big. There's still tapes.

[01:04:36:22 - 01:04:47:09]
Speaker 2
 The other thing is we we know people who are making movies and those movies either look horrible. I won't name names there. But like Silas, how old is Silas?

[01:04:47:09 - 01:04:51:17]
Speaker 3
 Um, he's probably in his upper 20s, maybe early 30s,

[01:04:51:17 - 01:04:58:15]
Speaker 2
 early 30s now. But I think they reach which was a really fantastic looking movie, if nothing else

[01:04:58:15 - 01:04:59:19]
Speaker 3
 six or seven years ago,

[01:04:59:19 - 01:05:05:12]
Speaker 2
 at least that long. So he was just in his mid 20s. And this kid has a fucking style.

[01:05:05:12 - 01:05:30:02]
Speaker 3
 He has such a good visual. Yeah. Like side to him as somebody who used him for my own content. Like he's he's incredible. He's great with art. So, yeah, there are some people just have a gift in certain directions and that just meshes with filmmaking really well. That's shitty. We should be nice to people who can make good content that we're grateful to watch and choose to watch that weekend rather than the other content we don't want to like.

[01:05:30:02 - 01:05:53:08]
Speaker 1
 I would say the odds on if you deeply looked into directors you really, really love. Yeah. And then check their age for us. Most directors do their best stuff from like 25 to 40. Yeah. And a lot of that stuff is when they're younger because you just you've got a crazy different view on the world. You're seeing things differently. You can work till two o'clock in the morning. Get back up at six. You've got no responsibilities. Perfectly fine.

[01:05:54:18 - 01:05:58:01]
Speaker 1
 Everything works three or four weeks in a row.

[01:05:58:01 - 01:05:58:15]
Speaker 2
 Yeah,

[01:05:58:15 - 01:06:24:03]
Speaker 3
 absolutely. Yeah, I'd be really curious to know when Buster Keaton made like the general or some of his stuff because he was doing vaudeville from the age of three. So, yeah, so he his early like movies were like really probably pretty early. I don't know. I'm curious. I just think that people are very naive if they think that you're not capable of making film at 20. It might feel early, but

[01:06:24:03 - 01:06:26:22]
Speaker 1
 when he's definitely early, but he certainly has the

[01:06:26:22 - 01:06:27:23]
Speaker 3
 he's got

[01:06:27:23 - 01:06:30:13]
Speaker 1
 a work doing it. Yeah. Of a level that

[01:06:30:13 - 01:06:35:00]
Speaker 3
 experience. Yeah. How old was this skin marine kid? I mean, like pretty

[01:06:35:00 - 01:06:35:07]
Speaker 1
 young.

[01:06:35:07 - 01:06:36:01]
Speaker 3
 Yeah.

[01:06:37:08 - 01:06:42:01]
Speaker 3
 Wow. That's frustrating. And that's from like just viewers or is it filmmakers?

[01:06:42:01 - 01:06:48:01]
Speaker 1
 Seems more like viewers, just like fan pages. You know, the joy of general fan pages.

[01:06:48:01 - 01:06:48:21]
Speaker 3
 Well,

[01:06:48:21 - 01:06:49:19]
Speaker 1
 any fandom.

[01:06:49:19 - 01:07:09:20]
Speaker 3
 I guess it doesn't matter because it seems to be doing really well. Yeah, no matter what. What they think. And since when do people really give a flying F about like how much a director did on set? It's like, do you want to get into Marvel? Because there is how many 30 something films we could talk about how little directors do on set.

[01:07:09:20 - 01:07:16:14]
Speaker 1
 Oh, God. Yeah. Well, one of the comparisons is popping up. There's got to be some Spielberg to his Toby Hooper

[01:07:16:14 - 01:07:17:09]
Speaker 2
 for

[01:07:17:09 - 01:07:19:22]
Speaker 1
 Paris for poltergeist and stuff like.

[01:07:20:22 - 01:07:33:10]
Speaker 2
 I did see that I saw that the director of back rooms leaned into it then and said every film that is directed by a new young director is actually directed by one director called The Gentleman.

[01:07:35:15 - 01:07:43:16]
Speaker 3
 It's really good. Like, yeah, it's extremely good. Yeah. That's somebody who loves himself some creepypasta.

[01:07:43:16 - 01:07:45:11]
Speaker 5
 Yeah. Oh,

[01:07:47:06 - 01:07:47:18]
Speaker 5
 man.

[01:07:48:20 - 01:07:51:12]
Speaker 2
 OK, well, let's see. I'm going to jump into something

[01:07:52:19 - 01:07:58:02]
Speaker 2
 that I forgot to talk about. You guys tell me, did I talk about Lee Cronin's The Mummy?

[01:07:58:02 - 01:08:00:09]
Speaker 3
 I don't recall you talking about Lee Cronin's

[01:08:00:09 - 01:08:05:06]
Speaker 1
 The Mummy. I don't think you have here. I don't remember your post or something about it or not

[01:08:05:06 - 01:08:09:06]
Speaker 2
 my post. I haven't posted a goddamn thing in twenty twenty six.

[01:08:09:06 - 01:08:10:02]
Speaker 5
 Some

[01:08:10:02 - 01:08:12:01]
Speaker 1
 replies and that's about it.

[01:08:12:01 - 01:08:12:14]
Speaker 2
 Yeah.

[01:08:14:01 - 01:08:34:18]
Speaker 2
 I saw Lee Cronin's The Mummy. I fucking loved it. Really? Fucking love it. Wow. I think everybody would love it if it was called anything but Lee Cronin's The Mummy. It's the worst thing of all time. Yeah. And I guarantee you, you know, listening to this guy, this is a guy that did Evil Dead Rise. If you like Evil Dead Rise, you will like The Mummy. It's an Evil Dead movie.

[01:08:35:21 - 01:08:36:00]
Speaker 2
 I

[01:08:36:00 - 01:08:37:05]
Speaker 3
 definitely will not like this movie.

[01:08:37:05 - 01:08:48:21]
Speaker 2
 That's OK. I guarantee that he did not go. I think we should call it My Name, The Mummy. That was the studio doing that to him either to fuck him over.

[01:08:49:23 - 01:08:58:16]
Speaker 2
 But probably to go, Christ, we've got Brendan Fraser coming back for The Mummy. Oh, yeah. I don't know why they kept The Mummy name. Why was that important?

[01:08:58:16 - 01:09:07:18]
Speaker 3
 That's the thing I've heard from reviews. It's a fun film. But why on earth did they call it a mummy movie or, you know, it's so tangentially. If it was

[01:09:07:18 - 01:09:21:21]
Speaker 2
 the revenge of The Mummy, you would have been fine with it. If it was The Mummy's curse, it would have been fine. Calling it The Mummy. There is a mummy, but it's not a traditional mummy. Mummy. But even then, when you think about it,

[01:09:22:21 - 01:09:35:00]
Speaker 2
 the Brendan Fraser mummy, that guy is not a traditional mummy either. He's just fucking, you know, he's in in the those. What am I doing here? Eric, God damn it. You're trying to talk. Turn your purple

[01:09:35:00 - 01:09:40:18]
Speaker 1
 down. There you go. I want to make sure people can hear your wisdom. God damn it. That's perfect.

[01:09:42:18 - 01:09:43:07]
Speaker 1
 Beautiful.

[01:09:44:10 - 01:09:45:21]
Speaker 2
 It was called The Mummy. I watched it.

[01:09:46:21 - 01:09:46:23]
Speaker 2
 Well,

[01:09:49:02 - 01:10:01:21]
Speaker 3
 I'm glad to hear that you liked it. I probably won't like it just because I was not a huge fan of the Evil Dead movie. But I also am like, I don't know if I want to watch like a little kid, like terrorizing another little kid. That's probably just

[01:10:01:21 - 01:10:08:21]
Speaker 2
 not. There's some child endangerment going on in this thing and some pretty fucking gruesome scenes that made me cover my eyes.

[01:10:08:21 - 01:10:21:23]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, I think I think I'm going to skip this one. It's not worth it. But I have heard that it is fun and like that people are kind of missing out. It just had the stupidest fucking title of all time. I was like, I'm sorry, you're not famous enough

[01:10:21:23 - 01:10:22:11]
Speaker 1
 to

[01:10:22:11 - 01:10:25:13]
Speaker 3
 have your name be attached to this movie in a meaningful way.

[01:10:25:13 - 01:10:36:02]
Speaker 2
 This is a movie that 10 years down the road is going to get a lot more love than it gets now because people are going to discover it and they're going to go, oh, I heard this was awful. And it's not awful.

[01:10:36:02 - 01:10:44:17]
Speaker 3
 Sure. Interesting. Well, speaking of awful, not awful, I saw Mandalorian and Grogu.

[01:10:46:01 - 01:11:09:00]
Speaker 3
 I think it was opening day because like I happen to have the day off and so did my husband. So we went midday and we got like a weird pack of special cards and there were all these people there at 3 p.m. in the afternoon, like going to see this film. I was like, I just want to come because I had the day off, but all right. It's fine. It's like

[01:11:10:11 - 01:11:11:17]
Speaker 3
 watching three episodes.

[01:11:11:17 - 01:11:13:19]
Speaker 1
 That's kind of what I've heard, too.

[01:11:13:19 - 01:11:23:00]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, it's fine. It doesn't feel like a movie experience at all. There's nothing about it that I was like, I am at the movies because I saw it in IMAX.

[01:11:24:00 - 01:11:24:13]
Speaker 2
 That's cool.

[01:11:24:13 - 01:11:50:04]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, it was fine. Yeah, it was OK. Yeah, I mean, I like the Mandalorian. I like Grogu just fine. I think that it was very weird, a very strange choice to try to make a hut hot. They take one of the job of the hut sons and try to make him hot. And they spend the whole film being like, but this guy, he's a hot hut. Girls are going to. Slug

[01:11:50:04 - 01:11:50:08]
Speaker 1
 with

[01:11:50:08 - 01:12:03:05]
Speaker 3
 abs. Yeah, slug with abs. Yeah. And he's got like a he's a cool guy. And yeah, that was a very strange choice. And I think that that might end up hurting them. But, you know, my thoughts are great.

[01:12:03:05 - 01:12:14:04]
Speaker 2
 I kind of liked that. I did make me go, who is Jabba fucking? It was not another hut. Right. I mean, because Jabba's arms are like this long.

[01:12:15:07 - 01:12:22:10]
Speaker 2
 And Rada or whatever his name, he's got full length arms. I was like, this is he had sex with something else to. Oh,

[01:12:22:10 - 01:12:24:18]
Speaker 3
 interesting. I did not pick up on that, but you're not wrong.

[01:12:26:01 - 01:12:29:04]
Speaker 1
 That only affected the top half and the slug took the bottom. Jabba can barely

[01:12:29:04 - 01:12:33:23]
Speaker 2
 hit three P.O. and knock him over. That's how short his arms were.

[01:12:33:23 - 01:12:36:00]
Speaker 3
 Oh, my God. I liked it.

[01:12:36:00 - 01:12:36:08]
Speaker 2
 I

[01:12:38:06 - 01:12:42:23]
Speaker 2
 will say that Pedro Pascal, who I've just about had enough of.

[01:12:44:10 - 01:13:11:20]
Speaker 2
 This is just the the best role in the world for him. He showed up for he showed up for one scene of acting where his helmet was taken off. Oh, OK. And then his other two, the guy who's the suit guy and then the guy who's the stunt guy are the actors to the rest of the movie. And he just goes in and gives dialogue. And yet his name is the first one on the list there. I was like, wow, you got it fucking made.

[01:13:11:20 - 01:13:13:00]
Speaker 3
 He really does.

[01:13:13:00 - 01:13:18:20]
Speaker 2
 He really does. I thought some of the effects were really cool. I'm also pretty tired of Grogu.

[01:13:18:20 - 01:13:19:13]
Speaker 3
 Yeah,

[01:13:19:13 - 01:13:20:22]
Speaker 2
 I think that's

[01:13:20:22 - 01:13:24:00]
Speaker 3
 fine. I just I'm yeah. I'm also like it's the same.

[01:13:24:00 - 01:13:26:14]
Speaker 1
 He hasn't grown. He hasn't changed. Well,

[01:13:26:14 - 01:13:48:22]
Speaker 2
 I really love the idea of Favreau going, hey, Lucas ripped off the hidden fortress for Star Wars. And I am going to rip off Lone Wolf and Cub for this movie. But I think maybe what I would like to have seen if we were going to do this is another samurai rip off or something that didn't have to have Grogu in it.

[01:13:50:18 - 01:13:51:19]
Speaker 2
 You know, I feel like

[01:13:53:00 - 01:14:06:14]
Speaker 2
 I feel like they painted themselves in a corner when that character got so fucking popular because my feeling is he probably was supposed to be there the first season. And then there was going to be new stories each time. And they got further and further away from their initial idea.

[01:14:06:14 - 01:14:12:08]
Speaker 3
 That's very possible. But I think it is going to bite them now because apparently it's doing pretty poorly

[01:14:12:08 - 01:14:14:15]
Speaker 1
 for what it is. It's not for the

[01:14:14:15 - 01:14:16:17]
Speaker 3
 amount of money they pumped into it.

[01:14:16:17 - 01:14:22:18]
Speaker 2
 It's doing solo numbers, which was the worst film or the worst

[01:14:23:19 - 01:14:26:12]
Speaker 2
 performing film in the series. So

[01:14:26:12 - 01:14:37:22]
Speaker 3
 yeah, I heard it. Definitely was not doing well for Disney. So, you know, it's it's tough. It's it's if they had made this movie two, three years ago, maybe

[01:14:37:22 - 01:14:39:09]
Speaker 1
 it's a long stretch from the

[01:14:39:09 - 01:14:47:10]
Speaker 3
 last like a long time. I like I had a hard time caring again about these characters. It's just been a while. So

[01:14:47:10 - 01:14:49:04]
Speaker 2
 also I thought the whole point was

[01:14:50:05 - 01:15:03:23]
Speaker 2
 this movie is going to wrap up everything that was introduced in The Mandalorian and Ahsoka. And I thought we were getting like everybody in this movie and we were getting an Avengers kind of collection. And none of that shit is talked about.

[01:15:03:23 - 01:15:04:15]
Speaker 3
 No,

[01:15:04:15 - 01:15:06:15]
Speaker 2
 the Mandalorian. I

[01:15:06:15 - 01:15:08:08]
Speaker 3
 was, you know, out of that one.

[01:15:08:08 - 01:15:18:06]
Speaker 2
 Yeah. So I don't know. I was I was fine with it. It was nice to see the stuff that I like. I thought the soundtrack was really good.

[01:15:19:13 - 01:15:20:08]
Speaker 2
 The score, I mean,

[01:15:20:08 - 01:15:27:01]
Speaker 3
 man, I should. Yeah, I did not pay enough attention, but I'm sure it was pretty solid. So I'm going to believe you.

[01:15:29:22 - 01:15:30:09]
Speaker 1
 You're welcome.

[01:15:31:12 - 01:15:38:02]
Speaker 1
 Okay. Well, I'll talk about the movie that's, you know, since it's box office stuff all the time online that's beating

[01:15:39:03 - 01:15:42:01]
Speaker 1
 Mandalorian and stuff, which is obsession.

[01:15:42:01 - 01:15:48:07]
Speaker 3
 But I I'm interested. I thought that from the trailer, it did not look that good.

[01:15:48:07 - 01:15:49:11]
Speaker 2
 You haven't seen

[01:15:49:11 - 01:15:51:08]
Speaker 3
 obsession. No, I'm going to see it tonight.

[01:15:53:00 - 01:15:54:02]
Speaker 3
 So don't naturally

[01:15:54:02 - 01:16:09:03]
Speaker 1
 carefully, especially because you have no time to forget. That's not the other year. I don't know if I'd go quite that far. It's beginning of the year. But I did like what's better than what I've seen so far this year. That's what I mean. Okay. Yeah, probably right there with that. It is.

[01:16:10:12 - 01:16:17:08]
Speaker 1
 Really, it is not entirely what I expected in that. And I don't know how to say this without being spoiler. It's.

[01:16:19:05 - 01:16:20:19]
Speaker 1
 I thought I was expecting.

[01:16:23:06 - 01:16:24:02]
Speaker 3
 Monkey Paw

[01:16:24:02 - 01:16:43:11]
Speaker 1
 movie. No, something darker. I was expecting it to be much darker and more violent than it actually is. And but it has moments of violence, but not very many. And the performances are honestly astounding at times. I think some of them are really, really good. Some of them are fine, but some are.

[01:16:44:15 - 01:16:45:00]
Speaker 1
 Wow.

[01:16:46:15 - 01:17:14:16]
Speaker 1
 The lead lady has like a Jim Carrey face. The expressions that can pull off and change are incredible and very low budget. This is another thing online that's showing people that they know nothing of the history of films. This is the first independent movie made for under a million dollars to make over a hundred million. It's like, no, it's not. It's probably made top five, at least before it. Yeah, but

[01:17:14:16 - 01:17:17:21]
Speaker 2
 paranormal activity was made for what?

[01:17:17:21 - 01:17:21:02]
Speaker 1
 Thirty thousand or seventy thousand Blair, which was thirty thousand.

[01:17:21:02 - 01:17:28:11]
Speaker 2
 Yeah. Paranormal activity made fucking seven hundred and fifty million dollars. Lovely ridiculous.

[01:17:28:11 - 01:17:41:10]
Speaker 1
 Yeah. But I think it's really well made. I liked it enough that I went and watched two or three of his short films. Wow. Also quite well done. He's him and the kind of.

[01:17:42:11 - 01:17:45:14]
Speaker 1
 Dopey Buddy in that are in most of his shorts.

[01:17:45:14 - 01:17:46:00]
Speaker 2
 Yeah.

[01:17:47:00 - 01:17:47:01]
Speaker 1
 And

[01:17:48:02 - 01:18:32:08]
Speaker 1
 one thing I found very interesting about the movie, about the idea behind the movie is he's like, well, what somebody asked him was the lore with the wish is like, I don't know. Yeah. We're just kind of having fun. I saw the monkey's paw thing on The Simpsons and went with something like that. I'm like, I love that. I kind of love that. Refreshing just, you know what? I thought this was one idea and I just made a movie like it. Like like my he said the same thing. One of his shorts called The Chair, which this guy picks a chair up off the side of the road and shit goes bad. And he's like, I don't know the lore of the chair either. I'm sure somebody up there written something in their brain that's really cool. But I don't have anything. I just thought the story I wrote was fun. Interesting.

[01:18:32:08 - 01:18:34:12]
Speaker 5
 I'm like, oh, OK. That's kind of cool.

[01:18:34:12 - 01:18:42:08]
Speaker 2
 Yeah. I thought it was really solid. There are some really creepy moments in there. Yeah. And

[01:18:44:13 - 01:18:53:09]
Speaker 2
 just a very satisfying conclusion. So I I was just blown away. I was like, wow, this is fucking solid.

[01:18:54:10 - 01:18:54:21]
Speaker 4
 Wow.

[01:18:54:21 - 01:18:56:16]
Speaker 2
 I can't believe you haven't seen this.

[01:18:56:16 - 01:18:58:02]
Speaker 3
 I know. I know.

[01:18:58:02 - 01:19:01:04]
Speaker 2
 I saw the Mandalorian and Grogu and you didn't see obsession.

[01:19:01:04 - 01:19:01:12]
Speaker 3
 I

[01:19:07:12 - 01:19:08:02]
Speaker 3
 don't

[01:19:10:09 - 01:19:10:09]
Speaker 2
 know.

[01:19:10:09 - 01:19:02:11]
Speaker 3
 I mean,

[01:19:03:15 - 01:19:08:15]
Speaker 3
 I guess it was out. I just I just had I wasn't super stoked about it.

[01:19:08:15 - 01:19:16:23]
Speaker 2
 Not only was out. So it did. It had a pretty gonzo opening weekend and then beat itself on its second weekend

[01:19:16:23 - 01:19:20:23]
Speaker 1
 by like 30 percent or something like that. Then

[01:19:20:23 - 01:19:37:23]
Speaker 2
 the Mandalorian and Grogu comes and takes first place midweek. Obsession beats it at the box office again. Retakes the number one spot. So this is a movie that is that everybody is saying, holy shit, you got to see this movie. So wow, you'll hate it. You'll hate it.

[01:19:37:23 - 01:19:58:02]
Speaker 3
 It's going to be another probably it's going to be another year where people love horror films and Hollywood is not going to know what to do with itself. It's like, oh, wait a minute. I thought last year was a fluke and we nominated weapons and centers. And I know exactly. And now it's like, oh, shit, maybe people like actually like horror movies and will pay to go see them over

[01:19:58:02 - 01:20:25:20]
Speaker 1
 some of the other. Part of the problem, though, gets to like you're talking about the Marvel's and Avengers movie at a certain budget peak when you're up there and your main job is actually crunching numbers and making sure stock prices are good and all that shit. And you really don't know a fucking thing about movies. You're just there because you've got billions of dollars and it could afford to be there and can pay for four hundred million dollar budget movie. The concept of making a movie for.

[01:20:27:06 - 01:20:34:06]
Speaker 1
 Under a million dollars must be unfathomable. And then the idea of, OK, this is.

[01:20:35:15 - 01:20:47:22]
Speaker 1
 I think I think two people worked on writing it. I remember him and somebody else, but I think it's the guys he worked with, basically the people he worked with making short films. It sounds like he's got like a little team, but

[01:20:49:07 - 01:20:50:01]
Speaker 1
 the.

[01:20:52:09 - 01:20:53:09]
Speaker 1
 That dynamic.

[01:20:54:14 - 01:20:56:12]
Speaker 1
 You know, the idea of.

[01:20:57:23 - 01:21:02:23]
Speaker 1
 Putting all the money in a thing and then leaving it alone has become more and more alien for the studios.

[01:21:04:04 - 01:21:13:22]
Speaker 1
 Creator controlled stuff is hard to come by unless you're working on any more like no money, fifteen million or low below. You could probably get a lot of freedom. But

[01:21:13:22 - 01:21:48:16]
Speaker 3
 yeah, it feels like there's usually you know, if you're lucky, there's a division that pops up in a larger system that's specifically for smaller things or somebody just is like, we don't care about this one side property like Mandalorian was like, we don't fucking care here. Some creative control and some money and we'll see if it's any good. And then they're like, oh, shit, this is like one of our most popular Star Wars things. Let's fuck it up. Let's fuck it up for sure. But like, I think that's how you get things like that. It has to come from being allowed to have that little creative spark on the side.

[01:21:49:22 - 01:21:55:02]
Speaker 2
 I know this guy's next movie is already in the can and focus features has it.

[01:21:56:22 - 01:22:06:13]
Speaker 2
 But, you know, I just know that Marvel is going to offer him twenty million dollars to direct something and we'll never see another cool thing from him again.

[01:22:06:13 - 01:22:10:15]
Speaker 1
 That is the current trend of the way things go. Yes.

[01:22:10:15 - 01:22:14:00]
Speaker 2
 He'll do the new moon night movie or something.

[01:22:15:01 - 01:22:17:07]
Speaker 1
 Might be a better movie then. Yeah, no kidding.

[01:22:18:13 - 01:22:25:10]
Speaker 2
 OK, I'm going to talk about then new on Netflix, The Burroughs, which I know the new liked it and

[01:22:25:10 - 01:22:28:17]
Speaker 3
 not finished, but I've seen a lot of it. So

[01:22:28:17 - 01:22:30:08]
Speaker 1
 that sounds familiar, but I'm

[01:22:30:08 - 01:22:34:10]
Speaker 2
 not. It's the old folks in the community that

[01:22:35:13 - 01:22:37:12]
Speaker 2
 that is there's something mysterious.

[01:22:37:12 - 01:22:45:01]
Speaker 1
 Right. Right. OK. Right. Yes. Yes. The one I watched, I think the first season of and then kind of forgot about. No, it's brand. OK, it's different.

[01:22:45:01 - 01:22:52:15]
Speaker 2
 Yeah. Yeah. This is Alfred Molina, Gina Davis, Alfred Woodward, a couple other people.

[01:22:54:11 - 01:23:07:22]
Speaker 2
 I'll tell you, there is some rough fucking writing in the first couple of episodes. And I was like, why are they infantilizing Alfred Molina so much? He looks like a 12 year old boy in this in the beginning

[01:23:09:03 - 01:23:18:20]
Speaker 2
 as he starts getting a little more obsessed and starts growing out his facial hair and everything. I was like, OK, there's the person we know is 72 years old. Sure.

[01:23:20:04 - 01:23:34:00]
Speaker 2
 And the story starts getting more interesting. But you got to sit through some pretty shit writing right off the bat. And I almost gave up on it. Luckily, I was doing mushroom gummies. So they kicked in and I got very invested.

[01:23:34:00 - 01:23:34:16]
Speaker 3
 I was

[01:23:35:17 - 01:23:41:05]
Speaker 3
 pretty excited because I misunderstood who had directed it. I thought it was the Duplass brothers.

[01:23:42:06 - 01:23:57:23]
Speaker 3
 And so I was watching. I was like, this is so much better than any of the other Duplass brothers stuff I've seen. They have come a long way. Wow. Look at these shots. They like make sense. This is great. And then I realized there's the Stranger Things guys. And I was like, oh, I am

[01:23:57:23 - 01:23:59:11]
Speaker 2
 the Duffer brothers.

[01:23:59:11 - 01:24:15:18]
Speaker 3
 The Duffer brothers really quite, quite different. So that gave it a lot of leeway for me. And I there was just a nice little I don't know writing wise, but I think directing wise, there was some really good subtle direction that was happening in it.

[01:24:16:21 - 01:24:56:14]
Speaker 3
 There's a relationship that's secret between two of the characters. And I remember looking at it like watching the party scene going, are those two people fucking? But it was not obvious. There was no clear indicators. I was like, there's like a weird something going on here. And then it's later revealed. And I was like, oh, shit, I was right. You guys did your job and you directed it and give some teeny tiny little piece of foreshadowing that allowed this to make sense. But you didn't like shove it down my throat. And that's kind of cool. So there's there's stuff I've been appreciating in it. And the only thing that's begging me so far is the security guard who is not a hopper,

[01:24:58:06 - 01:25:05:22]
Speaker 3
 but looks like him and acts like him. And he's basically that character. And I was like, guys, could you not have written fucking anything else? Well,

[01:25:05:22 - 01:25:10:04]
Speaker 2
 this is not written or directed by the Duffer brothers. They're executive producers.

[01:25:11:10 - 01:25:12:00]
Speaker 2
 So

[01:25:12:00 - 01:25:14:04]
Speaker 3
 it's weird. It's a weird choice.

[01:25:14:04 - 01:25:19:04]
Speaker 2
 Yeah, I agree. Also, that that thing you were talking about is

[01:25:20:15 - 01:25:23:22]
Speaker 2
 we're given a hint of it when

[01:25:25:03 - 01:25:33:01]
Speaker 2
 Bill Pullman is talking to Alfa Molina. And then she says something at the party. So we know immediately that that's what he was talking about.

[01:25:33:01 - 01:25:36:21]
Speaker 3
 I I miss that

[01:25:36:21 - 01:25:42:22]
Speaker 2
 Alfa Molina caught it. They look at him and he's like, oh, this is the person you were talking about. OK,

[01:25:42:22 - 01:25:47:13]
Speaker 3
 well, I still thought I was very good. I was very proud of myself for figuring it out.

[01:25:47:13 - 01:25:47:22]
Speaker 2
 But it's

[01:25:49:00 - 01:25:56:20]
Speaker 2
 it's fine. It has a it's it has an open ending. I mean, it's got an ending, but it's got an open end to it. So

[01:25:56:20 - 01:25:58:19]
Speaker 3
 like, do you think there will be a season two, then?

[01:25:58:19 - 01:26:11:04]
Speaker 2
 I don't think it's doing very well. I looked at the numbers and they said it was a pretty soft, softly watched. So who knows? But yeah, it was fine.

[01:26:12:14 - 01:26:14:13]
Speaker 3
 I was definitely very creeped out by the creature.

[01:26:14:13 - 01:26:15:04]
Speaker 2
 The creature was

[01:26:15:04 - 01:26:17:15]
Speaker 3
 creepy. He's fucking weird, man.

[01:26:17:15 - 01:26:18:02]
Speaker 5
 It was

[01:26:18:02 - 01:26:21:18]
Speaker 3
 like every time I showed up, I was like, fuck that thing. Smash it.

[01:26:22:22 - 01:26:24:10]
Speaker 3
 It's really upsetting.

[01:26:26:00 - 01:26:33:04]
Speaker 2
 Yeah, so it's on Netflix and it's eight episodes. It's just like all that other serious stuff. The Burroughs.

[01:26:34:14 - 01:26:37:21]
Speaker 3
 Well, I saw the back rooms,

[01:26:37:21 - 01:26:38:23]
Speaker 5
 which you're just taking

[01:26:38:23 - 01:26:48:20]
Speaker 3
 out. Very cool. And I I mostly liked it. I think it was a little bit of a slow burn. There

[01:26:48:20 - 01:26:49:06]
Speaker 1
 were like

[01:26:49:06 - 01:26:51:04]
Speaker 3
 baggy moments in there.

[01:26:51:04 - 01:26:56:02]
Speaker 1
 Because a lot of the movies it's getting compared to you don't like at all like the Varium and.

[01:26:56:02 - 01:27:05:05]
Speaker 3
 Oh, sure. I mean, liminal horror, I think, is interesting, though. I mean, I don't have a problem with Creepypasta. I love Channel Zero. It's just the

[01:27:06:06 - 01:27:09:16]
Speaker 3
 it just felt like it was spending a lot of time on certain things. And then

[01:27:11:23 - 01:27:22:18]
Speaker 3
 there's like not showing certain things. Maybe they should be showing and then showing too much of other things that they don't need to show. And the main character isn't who we're following for a long time.

[01:27:23:20 - 01:27:41:07]
Speaker 1
 That was a little weird, but I wonder if some of it is because you've said you've seen the whole series. I wonder if some of it feels that way for us that have seen the whole series where if you hadn't seen anything of back rooms, maybe you might need more of that.

[01:27:41:07 - 01:27:42:08]
Speaker 3
 Maybe I

[01:27:42:08 - 01:27:43:17]
Speaker 1
 weirdness building

[01:27:43:17 - 01:28:16:15]
Speaker 3
 up. If anything, I was actually pleasantly surprised because I felt like it was I was worried that watching all of the previous backroom stuff would really make this tedious and repetitive for me. But it was so neat that it was like a new piece of the same puzzle. So I actually felt like they did a great job because I was like, OK, we're not addressing stuff that we've already addressed before. Like I'm really excited to see this new little piece of it or this new little element or this new little addition to the lore. Like that was that was great to me.

[01:28:17:15 - 01:28:34:21]
Speaker 3
 But yeah, I think I think there was just a few things where, for example, we're seeing we're following this guy who owns this failing 90s furniture store. And he becomes obsessed with the secret space he finds in through the basement.

[01:28:34:21 - 01:28:36:05]
Speaker 1
 When you walk through a wall and

[01:28:36:05 - 01:28:43:15]
Speaker 3
 you're downstairs. And then like we cut like he goes in, we see him in there one time and then we cut to

[01:28:44:23 - 01:29:03:10]
Speaker 3
 a certain amount of length later where he's been obsessively going back in further and further. And we miss this whole exploration stage. And then we end up seeing the exploration stage again through another character. But we'd already seen his first. So we see his first experience with it and her first experience.

[01:29:03:10 - 01:29:08:14]
Speaker 1
 And that didn't bother me as much because they did it really quickly. Yeah, her first experience.

[01:29:09:22 - 01:29:19:11]
Speaker 1
 She went through the door relatively quickly. She moved around pretty quickly. So that didn't bother me too much. Yeah. Just because. But the switching of leads was

[01:29:19:11 - 01:29:33:23]
Speaker 3
 a little strange. I was like, wait, OK, so who's like who's who is changing in this film? I got to really pay attention at this point because I need to know who am I actually who's the actual character. And there was some really solid interesting stuff going around

[01:29:35:04 - 01:29:36:11]
Speaker 3
 the main characters

[01:29:37:23 - 01:29:42:14]
Speaker 3
 childhood versus what they were experiencing and analyzing. That was a lot of fun.

[01:29:44:00 - 01:29:47:22]
Speaker 1
 I think part of it was it's the back rooms.

[01:29:49:09 - 01:29:54:17]
Speaker 1
 The characters are secondary. That's true. So they'll be no, that's fair. And then they're like, oh, I'm going to shuffle through.

[01:29:54:17 - 01:30:24:00]
Speaker 3
 It's really just the space that we that's that's the concept overtakes the whole. And I will say that one thing that I can tell that, you know, what came Parsons did a great job but is still a kid who is figuring his shit out because at one point the guy is like, oh, and there's this pool back there. And then later you see this like these pools like really deep in the back rooms. That's another video game. That's a liminal horror video game that came out not that

[01:30:24:00 - 01:30:25:22]
Speaker 1
 long ago. Yeah. And I was

[01:30:25:22 - 01:30:36:08]
Speaker 3
 like, I've literally seen this pool in that game. And like as you know, clever and as unique and you know, he's still like he's still using

[01:30:36:08 - 01:30:37:00]
Speaker 1
 this will be fun.

[01:30:37:00 - 01:30:38:04]
Speaker 3
 This will be fun. I'm going to

[01:30:38:04 - 01:30:38:16]
Speaker 1
 like this

[01:30:38:16 - 01:30:45:03]
Speaker 3
 in. And I was like, I've seen this level. Like I know where this goes. Like what's up with that?

[01:30:45:03 - 01:30:48:00]
Speaker 1
 I guess I'm like the obsession guy. He has

[01:30:49:05 - 01:31:01:19]
Speaker 1
 the lore completely created. He just doesn't want it. He hasn't shared it. He doesn't. Maybe I'll put it at some point. I haven't really put out anything. Although I feel they explain it relatively well. They do. And

[01:31:01:19 - 01:31:17:00]
Speaker 3
 there's a lot of question marks still. But I think the ultimate question of like, do you need an answer or do you not need an answer? Like that's that's the interesting thing about it is like, do you actually really need to know why or do you not need to know why? So

[01:31:17:00 - 01:31:23:04]
Speaker 1
 I saw this in a new movie experience for me. Oh, have you heard of Cinemark's DX chairs?

[01:31:23:04 - 01:31:27:16]
Speaker 3
 Yes, I've gone. But I haven't experienced them doing anything. This

[01:31:27:16 - 01:32:19:13]
Speaker 1
 one did. Oh, God. It's a chair that's set up with like rumble elements and movement elements. Sense around. Yeah. And but the part that surprised me was they used it in the trailer. I'm watching the trailer from Jackass for Jackass. And somebody goes smack in my chair. Oh, my God. It's crazy. And so it was weird. And that you can turn it on. You can make it like there's three levels of intensity or turn it off. So for that one, I just turned it off. I don't need to follow Jackass this way. But what it did, one thing it did that was really weird, that almost like maybe drama would have been a good idea. But that opening scene where the guy is looking around and he's kind of like in a hazmat thing, the chair moved. Like when he went like this, the chair kind of felt like it went like this

[01:32:19:13 - 01:32:20:04]
Speaker 5
 weird,

[01:32:20:04 - 01:32:23:00]
Speaker 1
 like you were the person walking around.

[01:32:23:00 - 01:32:24:21]
Speaker 3
 Sure. There's some really big.

[01:32:24:21 - 01:32:26:01]
Speaker 1
 This is strange.

[01:32:27:13 - 01:32:28:19]
Speaker 1
 Overall, it's cool. I don't know

[01:32:29:20 - 01:32:30:04]
Speaker 1
 if I

[01:32:31:05 - 01:32:31:13]
Speaker 1
 want to.

[01:32:31:13 - 01:32:34:11]
Speaker 2
 I can't. Did you guys like the movie?

[01:32:34:11 - 01:32:35:08]
Speaker 1
 Yeah, I

[01:32:35:08 - 01:32:35:15]
Speaker 3
 did.

[01:32:35:15 - 01:32:36:04]
Speaker 2
 Yeah, I

[01:32:36:04 - 01:32:36:16]
Speaker 3
 think so.

[01:32:38:00 - 01:32:43:03]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, I think it was I think it was a pretty I don't know if I need to watch it again, but I think it was worth saying.

[01:32:43:03 - 01:32:49:08]
Speaker 2
 OK, I don't know anything about the bathrooms. I was like, the trailer did nothing for me. So I can probably won't.

[01:32:49:08 - 01:33:17:06]
Speaker 3
 I mean, it's it's it's kind of fun that it's like somebody, some human being out there was like, yo, look, I took this picture of this weird office I was in and it felt kind of creepy. And now we have an entire genre off of one teeny little feeling that somebody gets. I think that's really fascinating how we as people can suddenly take this one weird, slightly eerie feeling and explode it. Yeah.

[01:33:20:14 - 01:33:23:12]
Speaker 1
 Oh, it's the spider noir.

[01:33:23:12 - 01:33:26:22]
Speaker 3
 Oh, I have not watched it, but I'm excited to hear.

[01:33:26:22 - 01:33:30:23]
Speaker 1
 I will say thank you for recommending to watch it in color.

[01:33:32:02 - 01:33:46:15]
Speaker 1
 I've now watched three episodes. So I watched the first two in full color. The third I thought, OK, I at least want to see what this is going to look like a black and white. Halfway through, I'm going, but it's fine. Yeah. But it feels gimmicky. And the black and white.

[01:33:48:00 - 01:34:08:06]
Speaker 1
 Was shot color and then adapted to black and white as opposed to like if you see color pictures of all black and white movies. Shit looks weird. Yeah, because they dress everybody in colors and look good in black and white. Yeah. And that won't translate to color. Right. But it looks so good in color, though. It is. And

[01:34:09:13 - 01:34:20:01]
Speaker 2
 it's a lot of fun. It is a lot of fun. It's I'm I'm just happy that Nick Cage, who is a huge comic book fan, finally is in something that is a good comic book.

[01:34:20:01 - 01:34:22:18]
Speaker 3
 I didn't realize he was a huge comic book fan.

[01:34:22:18 - 01:34:27:06]
Speaker 2
 Oh, yeah. Superman number one. He was the one who bid on that and owned it.

[01:34:27:06 - 01:34:34:04]
Speaker 1
 He was dangerously cast by Kevin Smith as Superman in the 90s with the long hair. I thought

[01:34:35:12 - 01:34:40:18]
Speaker 2
 that was going to be Tim Burton. I don't think Smith got close enough to casting. He

[01:34:40:18 - 01:34:41:23]
Speaker 1
 wrote. Oh, I think you're right. Yeah.

[01:34:41:23 - 01:34:42:21]
Speaker 2
 But

[01:34:44:04 - 01:34:51:03]
Speaker 2
 and and Cage, first of all, his name is Coppola. He changed the cage because of Luke Cage.

[01:34:51:03 - 01:34:52:00]
Speaker 4
 Oh,

[01:34:52:00 - 01:34:59:17]
Speaker 2
 I didn't realize. And he and he was the one who really pushed hard for him to become Ghostwriter and all that stuff. So he's a huge comic book nerd.

[01:35:00:18 - 01:35:05:04]
Speaker 2
 So I was I was just happy to see him in something that was good.

[01:35:07:06 - 01:35:13:01]
Speaker 2
 Now, on the other hand, Nick Cage is 61 years old and I'm not sure he needs to be doing Spider-Man.

[01:35:15:11 - 01:35:32:17]
Speaker 1
 There's a there's a weird inconsistency in the writing. Sometimes it bugs me in that sometimes they just lean hard into the film noir language and other times they just sort of skip around it. It's like Apple pick one or the other, man. If you're going to go hard, which I wish they would. I wish they didn't like

[01:35:35:06 - 01:35:50:14]
Speaker 1
 the one Western that did I am a pemtameter where they just did everything deadwood, but they did everything that way. I wish they would have gone. We're going to write this like this is the sequel to Maltese Falcon. We're going to go for it. But they do at times and when they do, it's really cool.

[01:35:50:14 - 01:36:00:06]
Speaker 2
 I think this has been written. All episodes have been written by one person. That probably could have happened. It gets some. Now I liked it. I finished it. It gets pretty silly.

[01:36:01:07 - 01:36:04:13]
Speaker 1
 It's already starting to it. The third episode of God.

[01:36:05:19 - 01:36:18:02]
Speaker 1
 And there's some there's some weird effect changes when he's going to Spider-Man and stuff. At times there's like it looks cool, but it looks very cartoonish. Yeah, but it still looks cool. Yeah.

[01:36:18:02 - 01:36:30:05]
Speaker 2
 I'm really surprised to see that it is like it is a monster hit for Prime. I was like, who's watching this? I just assumed it would just be the regular comic book nerds. But apparently

[01:36:30:05 - 01:36:42:11]
Speaker 3
 I don't know who watches Prime though, because every time the like most watched or recommendation stuff shows up, I'm like, what? What is this movie from like 1992, like number number three in the top 10

[01:36:42:11 - 01:36:45:05]
Speaker 1
 based maybe based on your. Yeah.

[01:36:46:05 - 01:36:46:08]
Speaker 1
 So

[01:36:46:08 - 01:36:56:09]
Speaker 3
 it's so far removed from anything I watch. I would I would definitely agree normally. But this one I'm like, what the F. OK, people be weird.

[01:36:57:16 - 01:36:58:00]
Speaker 1
 The

[01:36:59:12 - 01:37:06:16]
Speaker 1
 action movie sequel you guys were talking about a couple of weeks ago that you hated so much the about the world ending one or whatever that was.

[01:37:07:23 - 01:37:12:11]
Speaker 1
 But that one popped up as like number two or three for me, like last week and going

[01:37:12:11 - 01:37:13:15]
Speaker 2
 Green Land

[01:37:13:15 - 01:37:14:07]
Speaker 1
 to Green

[01:37:14:07 - 01:37:19:05]
Speaker 3
 Land to watch that yet. By all means, treat yourself.

[01:37:20:06 - 01:37:27:07]
Speaker 3
 Maybe eat as many gummies as you can. It might give you something a little special that I did not get from that film.

[01:37:27:07 - 01:37:33:22]
Speaker 2
 Don't tell me what to do. I would have done it anyway. OK,

[01:37:36:02 - 01:37:40:04]
Speaker 2
 that's Spider Noir. I do like that he's not called Spider-Man. He's just called the Spider.

[01:37:40:04 - 01:37:41:11]
Speaker 1
 That's cool. That

[01:37:41:11 - 01:37:43:00]
Speaker 2
 makes a little more sense for that

[01:37:43:00 - 01:37:53:08]
Speaker 1
 kind of the alterations they've made to the villains, I think fit the style like Electro being Dopey. I love it. So it's pretty cool. Yeah.

[01:37:53:08 - 01:37:57:23]
Speaker 2
 Spider Noir free on Prime as long as you are paying for Prime.

[01:37:57:23 - 01:38:02:00]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, you or someone you know is paying for Prime.

[01:38:02:00 - 01:38:08:23]
Speaker 2
 OK, guys, how about we take a little break and then when we come back, we are going to be talking about Vanessa's pick. Uhoo.

[01:38:18:21 - 01:38:25:15]
Speaker 16
 Spider-Man Battle Action,quarta che potenza. Infugna Spider-Man Battle Action,comanda ai suoi super colpi.

[01:38:26:18 - 01:38:35:08]
Speaker 16
 Sferracanci,fugni,l'angiaragnatele,e neutralizza i nemici. Spider-Man Battle Action,un gigante di super potenza.Sono da. Già,difizio.

[01:38:37:22 - 01:38:42:21]
Speaker 16
 tras forma, being Spider-Man. et plus vos, et plus vos, et plus vos, et plus, et plus, et plus, et plus, et plus.

[01:38:44:13 - 01:38:53:14]
Speaker 16
 f**k yay! e Eric.

[01:38:58:12 - 01:39:00:14]
Speaker 5
 I'm going to have nightmares about

[01:39:00:14 - 01:39:05:09]
Speaker 3
 that now. Just be like, "Damn, was that a car exploding or did Eric clap nearby?"

[01:39:07:07 - 01:39:07:14]
Speaker 3
 Anyway.

[01:39:07:14 - 01:39:08:10]
Speaker 2
 We've got the clap.

[01:39:08:10 - 01:39:08:18]
Speaker 5
 We all

[01:39:08:18 - 01:39:14:09]
Speaker 2
 say it. That's right. Vanessa, this was your choice this year.

[01:39:14:09 - 01:39:27:05]
Speaker 3
 I'm awake. Yes. I chose a film that I've been meaning to watch for years and years and years and have not seen. Really, the more I watched it, the more I realized this should have been Eric's pick. But...

[01:39:27:05 - 01:39:28:16]
Speaker 1
 That's fair.

[01:39:28:16 - 01:39:41:04]
Speaker 3
 Every time I was writing something down, I was like, "Gosh, yeah, Eric would have done this so much better, Justice." But that's okay. I went with Dario Argento's 1987 film opera.

[01:39:41:04 - 01:39:53:16]
Speaker 4
 All

[01:39:57:15 - 01:39:59:00]
Speaker 4
 this turns you on, doesn't it?

[01:39:59:00 - 01:39:59:22]
Speaker 1
 What are you talking about?

[01:39:59:22 - 01:40:01:10]
Speaker 16
 You're a sadist.

[01:40:01:10 - 01:40:01:22]
Speaker 4
 Oh,

[01:40:01:22 - 01:40:02:08]
Speaker 1
 really?

[01:40:02:08 - 01:40:05:03]
Speaker 16
 Everyone I know who knows you says the same thing.

[01:40:05:03 - 01:40:09:11]
Speaker 5
 Good joy, good last night, you whore. You upper singers are all whores.

[01:40:10:14 - 01:40:12:01]
Speaker 5
 So you think this opera brings bad luck?

[01:40:12:01 - 01:40:14:16]
Speaker 5
 I don't know. That's what everyone says.

[01:40:17:22 - 01:40:22:05]
Speaker 16
 Ravens are very vindictive. They don't forget. They remember for

[01:40:22:05 - 01:40:24:16]
Speaker 5
 years and at the right moment, stop.

[01:40:26:22 - 01:40:30:22]
Speaker 5
 Lock all the windows. I look around in the street. If I see anything suspicious, I'll phone you.

[01:40:30:22 - 01:40:41:16]
Speaker 5
 I have to talk to you about something else. Something really serious. There's this maniac who's after me. I need your advice on what to do. There's only one thing to do. Call the police.

[01:40:46:15 - 01:40:49:02]
Speaker 5
 Bertie? Is that you? Who's there?

[01:40:52:07 - 01:40:53:12]
Speaker 5
 You

[01:40:56:03 - 01:41:12:15]
Speaker 5
 know, I've thought of a way to identify the killer. I don't know why I didn't think of it before. No!

[01:41:15:18 - 01:41:17:03]
Speaker 4
 No! No!

[01:41:18:19 - 01:41:19:00]
Speaker 4
 No!

[01:41:20:10 - 01:41:23:14]
Speaker 4
 No! No! No! Oh, my God!

[01:41:24:19 - 01:41:24:01]
Speaker 4
 No! Oh, let me see

[01:41:29:19 - 01:41:52:18]
Speaker 3
 So this was written and directed by Argento, who has 28 directing credits, 44 writing, including "Bird with the Crystal Plumage," "Cat in Nine Tales," "Deep Red Suspiria," "Inferno," "Tana Brie," "Phanomena," and the 1998 "Phantom of the Opera," which is a lot like this movie to an extent. I guess he likes this plot somehow.

[01:41:52:18 - 01:42:01:10]
Speaker 1
 I have a note on that if you're curious. I am curious. He insists in the booklet, maybe there he insists this is not based on "Phantom of the Opera."

[01:42:01:10 - 01:42:03:00]
Speaker 3
 It's so based on

[01:42:03:00 - 01:42:09:11]
Speaker 1
 "Phantom of the Opera." He said, nope, it's not, it's absolutely not. It's based on this idea I had, nothing to do with "Phantom of the Opera," and that's part of the reason I think he did

[01:42:09:11 - 01:42:12:00]
Speaker 3
 "The Phantom of the Opera." Eventually, because he was like, "This, if

[01:42:12:00 - 01:42:13:16]
Speaker 1
 I was gonna do it." This is actually my version.

[01:42:13:16 - 01:42:29:20]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, he might not be conscious, but there's so much in there. He was like, "Really?" Especially the set up. It's co-written by Franco Farini, 75 credits including "Phanomena," "Once Upon a Time in America," "Demone,"

[01:42:31:06 - 01:43:00:03]
Speaker 3
 starring Christina Marcilac, Marcilac. As Betty, she has 30 credits, mostly European. Ian Charleston as the director of "Marco," 29 credits including "Cheriot's a Fire," "Gondi," and lots of BBC TV live theater. This was his last theatrical performance before "Dying of AIDS," which he discovered he had on the set of this film. Oh, shit. Yeah, he got an offender bender, and when he got checked out, discovered he had contracted HIV.

[01:43:01:06 - 01:43:29:20]
Speaker 3
 Urbano Barbini as Inspector Santini, 62 credits including "Demons," "Gore," "Gortu," "Casino Royale," and lots of Italian content. And Dario Nicoldi as Maria, who has 38, or Mira, 38 credits, frequently worked with Argento with his longtime partner, never married, worked with him acting in "Phanomena," Deep Red Tanabre, and wrote "Susperia." She is the mother of Asia Argento.

[01:43:29:20 - 01:43:36:22]
Speaker 1
 Michael Suva is in this too, the director of "Cemetary Man," and all that stuff. He's like one of the detectives or one of the police.

[01:43:36:22 - 01:43:53:11]
Speaker 3
 I totally did not pick up on that. That's crazy. Yeah, there was a few points. Because there's so many accents happening in this movie, it's of course dubbed, but you're like, some of you are Italian, some of you are very English, very English, some of you are American, I don't know what

[01:43:53:11 - 01:43:54:06]
Speaker 5
 is going on

[01:43:54:06 - 01:44:00:02]
Speaker 3
 here, but it's just a nice, Yeah. chronicopia of accents.

[01:44:01:12 - 01:44:28:17]
Speaker 3
 So the story follows. There is a dress rehearsal underway for Verdi's "Macbeth" at the Parma Opera House, TV slash film director, Marco, who's known for his horror movies, has included several unusual elements in this play, including, well, in this opera, including live ravens. The ravens upset the lead singer, Marek Kova, who storms out and is then hit by a car.

[01:44:29:22 - 01:44:30:08]
Speaker 3
 Quick note

[01:44:30:08 - 01:44:39:14]
Speaker 1
 on this. I don't think Dario has ever had any time in theater. The amount of times they say Macbeth in a theater on the stage have gone,

[01:44:39:14 - 01:44:40:06]
Speaker 3
 oh. I

[01:44:40:06 - 01:44:40:20]
Speaker 1
 do have one

[01:44:40:20 - 01:44:49:00]
Speaker 3
 small note on that later, but I know I had to stop myself from saying Macb because I did theater, but I'm like, no, no, no, it's okay.

[01:44:49:00 - 01:44:52:13]
Speaker 2
 Explain to the people who have not done theater.

[01:44:52:13 - 01:45:16:08]
Speaker 3
 So Macbeth as a play has been known as the cursed play. A lot of times accidents happen surrounding it. It's just one of those things where it feels like if you're gonna put this on, you gotta be careful not to jinx yourself, not, you know, people get injured, people die, things happen to the set. So it's just a play that's sort of got a black mark on it.

[01:45:16:08 - 01:45:18:21]
Speaker 2
 And so you can't say Macbeth inside

[01:45:18:21 - 01:45:25:00]
Speaker 1
 the theater. Except, you know, in the lines when you're performing, you're fine, but when you're talking about it, you do not. You have to

[01:45:25:00 - 01:45:29:10]
Speaker 3
 say something else, and I was taught Macb, but it might be other things for other people.

[01:45:30:19 - 01:45:39:14]
Speaker 3
 So of course, following that, the role of Lady Macbeth is given to the understudy, Betty, cool name, guys, couldn't come up with fucking A there.

[01:45:41:06 - 01:46:13:20]
Speaker 3
 The names are so stupid. Who's nervous to take the role due to the play's curse. However, she takes it and does a brilliant performance becoming instantly famous, though there is one accident in the play with a stagehand. And by accident, I mean a murder where his head is impaled on a coat hook, and then the lights fall off a balcony from above. Yeah, and later they're like, yeah, there's a weird thing that happened with the stagehand, and you're like, he was horrifically brutally murdered? Nope, nobody cares, all right, good to know.

[01:46:15:09 - 01:46:27:06]
Speaker 3
 That night, the same murderer steals her costume, kind of, he's like back there, and he grabs her costume and stabs it a bunch with a knife. Of course, he has gloved hands, his faces, or her face is covered,

[01:46:28:09 - 01:46:37:13]
Speaker 3
 and starts aggravating the ravens, which they then kill three of, at least. I really hope they didn't actually murder birds, but it's so hard to tell.

[01:46:37:13 - 01:46:40:15]
Speaker 2
 Dave, there was definite animal cruelty on this film.

[01:46:40:15 - 01:46:47:21]
Speaker 3
 It really felt like there was some level of animal cruelty. I was, when I was seeing them slashing birds' hearts, I was going,

[01:46:49:05 - 01:46:53:00]
Speaker 3
 where are we in? What country? Cold, cold.

[01:46:54:01 - 01:46:54:22]
Speaker 3
 Hi, standards.

[01:46:56:00 - 01:47:37:02]
Speaker 3
 Meanwhile, after her performance, Betty goes and hooks up with the stage manager, Stefano. She finds sex really difficult for some reason, but he's very accepting of it not being awesome, and apparently they've been together for a while because they're familiar, but also maybe this is their first time. Who knows? The writing's very unclear. That's pretty good. While he goes to grab some tea, I think, the gloved murderer enters, ties her up, and tapes a line of needles underneath her lower eyelid so she cannot close her eyes without injuring herself. The gloved figure then proceeds to brutally murder her lover, forcing her to watch. Then they cut her rope loose and leave. She frees herself.

[01:47:37:02 - 01:47:59:23]
Speaker 1
 I'll step back a little on this one. This murder is brutal. It's pretty rough. This was the first-- There's a lot of stabbing. The first Igento movie I'd seen, a shot of life going into the mouth. Yeah. Always stuck with me. I could remember almost nothing about the movie. I remember that. And also, Steel Grave,

[01:48:01:03 - 01:48:02:07]
Speaker 1
 the metal music. Oh,

[01:48:02:07 - 01:48:04:09]
Speaker 2
 the metal music. Oh my God, yeah.

[01:48:04:09 - 01:48:08:23]
Speaker 3
 Oh my God, the metal music. How fun. You know what?

[01:48:08:23 - 01:48:12:01]
Speaker 2
 I appreciated it because this movie

[01:48:13:08 - 01:48:23:02]
Speaker 2
 is fucking scored with just opera for the most part. And in every fucking scene while they're having dialogue, while they're doing all this stuff, he goes,

[01:48:23:02 - 01:48:23:23]
Speaker 4
 "Whoa, whoa,

[01:48:23:23 - 01:48:28:18]
Speaker 2
 whoa, whoa, whoa." And I was just like, I am fucking going crazy.

[01:48:30:20 - 01:48:37:15]
Speaker 3
 I don't know. I wish they could have gotten better metal. I don't know anything about metal, but I was like, this is some pretty

[01:48:37:15 - 01:48:40:19]
Speaker 2
 low-- Late 80s. It was very generic.

[01:48:40:19 - 01:48:44:23]
Speaker 3
 It was pretty crummy metal. I was like, guys, please.

[01:48:44:23 - 01:48:46:06]
Speaker 2
 Is that really the name of the band?

[01:48:46:06 - 01:48:46:16]
Speaker 3
 Yeah.

[01:48:48:19 - 01:48:48:19]
 (Laughing)

[01:48:48:19 - 01:48:50:16]
Speaker 1
 All right. Yep, looked it up.

[01:48:52:00 - 01:49:07:05]
Speaker 3
 Truly terrible. So after she watches her lover horrifically murdered, there's several pretty intense murders out here. She frees herself, runs to a phone booth, and calls the police but leaves herself anonymous, presumably because she's now famous and doesn't want the scandal.

[01:49:07:05 - 01:49:11:07]
Speaker 2
 Yeah, that was already like, what's going on in the writing in this fucking film?

[01:49:11:07 - 01:49:32:21]
Speaker 3
 It was kind of weird. I was like, you've been famous for like eight, four hours at this point. Like you had enough time to finish your play, go have sex with this guy. It's not morning. It's still night. And you're so famous that when you call the police, you're like, I best not get my name solided in this mess.

[01:49:32:21 - 01:49:39:10]
Speaker 2
 I think you'll be fine. Makes a lot of questionable choices. Oh, jeez, yes. Concerning the people dying around her.

[01:49:39:10 - 01:49:53:08]
Speaker 3
 It's very true. It's very true. But I will say everyone she tells either doesn't care or doesn't think it's a big deal or is kind of more like, oh, that's interesting. Like they don't, nobody in this reacts to like murder the way you probably should.

[01:49:54:18 - 01:50:16:15]
Speaker 3
 The glove figure continues to haunt her, doing this several more times to various friends of hers. In one incident, they leave a gold bracelet behind in an inscription which links her to the murderer. She also has vague memories and dreams that make it feel like the figure is somehow familiar to her. She does finally get the police involved.

[01:50:17:18 - 01:50:53:22]
Speaker 3
 Betty invites her agent. I think it's her agent, the chick, the older chick who's played by Argento's lady. And good friend over to talk with her about what's going on with the police or while the police are watching the lobby downstairs. A policeman, however, has come to hang out in her apartment and she uses eye drops and her eye drops are totally normal eye drops but somehow she can't see anything. I was like, is this, is she supposed to have her eyes poisoned or like something at this point? Like what is going on?

[01:50:53:22 - 01:50:56:21]
Speaker 1
 That whole scene is such a bizarre group of messiness.

[01:50:56:21 - 01:51:11:08]
Speaker 3
 She's like, my eyes hurt. I feel like she was gonna take a sleeping pill or something and I'm only gonna lock one of my two doors and I'm gonna put shit in my eyes so I can't see anything. I'm like, girl,

[01:51:12:12 - 01:51:17:03]
Speaker 3
 what are you doing? This is not called high alert. This is not called being safe.

[01:51:17:03 - 01:51:20:00]
Speaker 1
 Oh, you're here? I'll unlock my door. Come on up.

[01:51:20:00 - 01:51:52:14]
Speaker 3
 Come on up. I'm not gonna even look at you or even I'm just gonna trust that you are who you say you are. So this policeman's in her apartment. However, when her friend arrives, she reveals that the police officer is still down in the lobby and the person in her apartment is not in fact the police officer. So, or it is, or, you know, so at this point, who is, you know, cause we haven't seen them. So is it her friend? Is it the officer downstairs? Is the officer upstairs? We don't know who could be doing this. So

[01:51:54:00 - 01:51:59:11]
Speaker 3
 stuff happens. I was trying really hard not to give too much away. Betty tries to escape.

[01:51:59:11 - 01:52:03:07]
Speaker 1
 Well, these episodes, we talk about everything.

[01:52:03:07 - 01:52:15:05]
Speaker 3
 Spoiler share. If you don't wanna talk about it, that's perfectly fine. I don't wanna reveal who the villain is for anybody who just, so her friend is killed, but Betty tries to escape and the,

[01:52:16:06 - 01:52:30:23]
Speaker 3
 escape the assailant and a little girl beckons to her from, to climb into a venting system. Cause we've seen these like shadows in this vent system up until now. And then it's revealed that it's just this little girl who's bored and kind of her parents are abusive.

[01:52:30:23 - 01:52:31:20]
Speaker 1
 Keeping Tom.

[01:52:31:20 - 01:52:56:13]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, and she's been watching her forever. And she's like, yeah, come on up. While they are climbing around in the vents, they discover an unused apartment. I'm not sure if this is supposed to mean something. And then the little girl helps Betty find refuge and escape into her apartment. I was very confused as to like what the deal was with the abandoned apartment that they go past. And they kind of spent a long time looking at it.

[01:52:56:13 - 01:52:58:13]
Speaker 1
 I know that one is like, okay.

[01:52:58:13 - 01:53:05:21]
Speaker 3
 It looks like a music video site. It's like very like gothic and there's just like stuff swirling around in it. You know, it's Argento.

[01:53:05:21 - 01:53:07:06]
Speaker 1
 It's gotta have shit that looks cool.

[01:53:07:06 - 01:53:15:01]
Speaker 3
 The director of the opera gets an idea for how to discover who is behind the murders. I think this is pretty clever. The next performance. Stormers.

[01:53:16:05 - 01:53:21:14]
Speaker 3
 Look, apparently Ravens remember. But there's truth to that.

[01:53:21:14 - 01:53:23:23]
Speaker 1
 Yeah, for sure. Just release.

[01:53:23:23 - 01:53:26:00]
Speaker 5
 Yeah, it's great. It's a four crowded theater.

[01:53:26:00 - 01:53:34:15]
Speaker 3
 Who cares? Shit goes horribly wrong. I mean, it's a little, people get a little something extra than what they paid for. They get live bird show.

[01:53:34:15 - 01:53:35:03]
Speaker 1
 There you go.

[01:53:35:03 - 01:53:46:06]
Speaker 3
 So during the performance, they've released the Ravens who circle around the crowd and they assume that the murderer will be there and that the Ravens will hone in and attack them. And they do.

[01:53:47:23 - 01:54:05:00]
Speaker 3
 So the crowd goes crazy, starts running around. It becomes really chaotic. Betty runs off and is cornered by the murderer in a small room where the murderer lights themselves on fire and she is locked inside and must escape by getting the key off the burning body.

[01:54:06:04 - 01:54:06:11]
Speaker 2
 Yeah.

[01:54:06:11 - 01:54:09:21]
Speaker 3
 Then we cut to several days, weeks, hours later.

[01:54:09:21 - 01:54:19:17]
Speaker 1
 There was a very weird problem with that scene in that, I mean, I know why they did it, there's just poor writing choices. He spends the entire movie forcing her to watch everything.

[01:54:19:17 - 01:54:20:10]
Speaker 5
 Yeah.

[01:54:20:10 - 01:54:28:05]
Speaker 1
 And then when he gets directly in, well, it's like, well, because if I do this with you not having a blindfold, the movie, there's a movie problem.

[01:54:28:05 - 01:54:30:17]
Speaker 2
 There is a movie problem. For story, I need this to happen.

[01:54:30:17 - 01:54:48:22]
Speaker 3
 And why this has to be the ending, I don't get it anyway because it's like, okay, then we go several weeks later after the murderer has lit themselves on fire in this room, Betty is working with the director on his next big project in the Swiss Alps, but there's Germans, it's fine.

[01:54:50:03 - 01:54:51:20]
Speaker 3
 On the TV, it is revealed

[01:54:52:22 - 01:55:01:01]
Speaker 3
 immediately that the burned body was a dummy and the director runs out and yells to Betty who's doing a big fields are alive.

[01:55:02:16 - 01:55:13:19]
Speaker 3
 And he's like, Betty, run, this is alive. And then just then the murderer shows up and there's a final showdown with Betty in the grass.

[01:55:13:19 - 01:55:20:08]
Speaker 1
 I'm curious, did you watch the directors cut? Yes. So it's a very weird ending crawling through the grass?

[01:55:20:08 - 01:55:20:14]
Speaker 3
 Yes.

[01:55:20:14 - 01:55:21:21]
Speaker 1
 Yeah, that was psyched.

[01:55:21:21 - 01:55:23:10]
Speaker 3
 I was really like,

[01:55:24:19 - 01:55:31:12]
Speaker 3
 I am okay. I was like, are you gonna like torture this lizard right now or are you not gonna, I guess that's the big, is she, won't she?

[01:55:31:12 - 01:55:33:20]
Speaker 1
 I love life more now.

[01:55:35:06 - 01:55:37:04]
Speaker 3
 I am not horrible.

[01:55:37:04 - 01:55:46:02]
Speaker 2
 Going back to the Ravens circling, that scene was laugh out loud bad with the camera swooping above the audience and the people going.

[01:55:46:02 - 01:55:46:07]
Speaker 4
 A peachy.

[01:55:47:08 - 01:56:06:14]
Speaker 2
 And the clear shadow of the camera on them as it was passing and everything. And I was like, Eric, do you like this movie? It's fine. I was like, I don't understand the love for this movie unless it's a so bad it's good movie because this movie, the writing is garbage.

[01:56:06:14 - 01:56:07:07]
Speaker 3
 It's pretty bad.

[01:56:08:08 - 01:56:22:22]
Speaker 2
 Some of the photography is really bad. The leaps of logic that you have to take to understand why she is not helping the police find this guy who tried to kill him. Why are you actively trying to stop the police from helping you?

[01:56:22:22 - 01:56:23:09]
Speaker 3
 Right.

[01:56:23:09 - 01:56:24:05]
Speaker 2
 Oh, there is, oh no.

[01:56:24:05 - 01:56:31:15]
Speaker 3
 Even the motive of the murderer, I was like, what now? I really don't fully grasp that section either.

[01:56:31:15 - 01:56:40:17]
Speaker 2
 The one thing I liked was when she's out there talking in the Alps and she sees the police dogs running in the distance. And

[01:56:41:17 - 01:56:54:20]
Speaker 2
 then it's just a shot, it's not explained. And then he comes out and starts yelling and she's like on the move because she has put together, why are there police dogs out here in the middle of the woods? And I was like, that's fucking brilliant. That's a good leap.

[01:56:54:20 - 01:57:03:05]
Speaker 3
 This is a good leap. I was very confused because confession, I saw them and went, we're in Germany, of course there's German shepherds running around.

[01:57:04:12 - 01:57:16:06]
Speaker 3
 Of course, why wouldn't there be German shepherds? And they did not doubt on me until so much later that that was meant to be a little clue for her. I was like, oh, okay. I just thought somebody nearby owned a bunch of dogs.

[01:57:16:06 - 01:57:24:06]
Speaker 1
 I have a few silly notes too about the movie itself before we do any trivia stuff. She has a copy of "Purple Rain" on her shelf. She does, doesn't she?

[01:57:24:06 - 01:57:24:19]
Speaker 2
 I saw that, yeah.

[01:57:24:19 - 01:57:32:05]
Speaker 1
 She doesn't do-- "Purple Rain," oh, and "Big Beth," and "Blade Runner." I was like, all right, that's kind of cool.

[01:57:32:05 - 01:57:33:22]
Speaker 3
 She's a cool girl.

[01:57:33:22 - 01:57:34:10]
Speaker 1
 And

[01:57:35:15 - 01:57:47:16]
Speaker 1
 to continue the problem with not understanding a goddamn thing about a stage production, the not so bad but still ridiculous was that wardrobe room being an utter disastrous mess.

[01:57:47:16 - 01:57:48:20]
Speaker 4
 Oh, it was such a mess.

[01:57:48:20 - 01:58:19:14]
Speaker 1
 And there were so many sewing machines. On a professional production, that's not happening. But the backstage during the performance, it's like, I want to cloud my fucking eyes without watching this. There's no white lights behind a stage when people are on stage, it's red light. And it's usually just for the people that have to have a script they're following along, like the "Light Queue" guys, if they're in the backstage or some shit like that. And all the people yelling and running around going, this is

[01:58:20:18 - 01:58:38:15]
Speaker 1
 the worst play production I've ever seen. This would not work on stage at all. No, it's pretty rough. And that sort of goes along with a lot of the rest of the movie. There's leaps and bounds and things that are done, sometimes that end up looking cool,

[01:58:39:17 - 01:58:42:17]
Speaker 1
 but are done to look cool, sometimes do, sometimes don't.

[01:58:42:17 - 01:58:55:06]
Speaker 3
 Sometimes don't, for sure. One of my personal gripes was there's a scene where she's like running through traffic and like a white t-shirt and no bra. And I was like, there's no reason for any of this.

[01:58:55:06 - 01:58:58:11]
Speaker 1
 Yeah, there is, but you know, not a good reason.

[01:58:58:11 - 01:59:12:11]
Speaker 3
 But she wasn't running before and then she's like, I got to run now poorly, but like my boobs are everywhere. I was like, this is, it does not look that good guys, in my opinion. I was like, this is, all right, that's fine.

[01:59:12:11 - 01:59:15:11]
Speaker 1
 Well, you know, if she'd been like, I don't even know if I want to get it.

[01:59:15:11 - 01:59:20:09]
Speaker 2
 Well, I mean, that was one of the scenes where I just started laughing out loud. Yes, this is a fight, Dom.

[01:59:21:19 - 01:59:32:00]
Speaker 2
 I think people think this movie is a classic. Steve Holitz is listening to this, he's angry at me right now. I guarantee Steve Holitz thinks this movie is fucking great. This is a garbage movie.

[01:59:33:02 - 01:59:46:06]
Speaker 3
 It's interesting. So one of the reasons I avoided watching this movie for a long time was because of the cover with the needles with the eye, because I have such, I cannot handle eye damage.

[01:59:46:06 - 01:59:47:16]
Speaker 2
 Right there with you, right there with you.

[01:59:47:16 - 01:59:56:12]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, that's one of those things that as soon as I get any hint, something's going to happen, I automatically just cover up my eyes. I don't want to see it. I don't want to know what it looks like. I don't want to know what they do.

[01:59:57:15 - 02:00:03:06]
Speaker 3
 And actually it was not too bad in this film. The needles don't look like they would actually penetrate that.

[02:00:03:06 - 02:00:06:07]
Speaker 2
 Yeah, the way it's set up, I was like, okay, there's no danger.

[02:00:06:07 - 02:00:09:14]
Speaker 1
 I mean, if you went like this, it's going to get like your eyebrow.

[02:00:09:14 - 02:00:38:23]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, you're going to get your eyebrow or maybe the top a little bit, but it would not be hitting the eyeball, which I was actually like, okay. And it's not used. I thought it was going to be the whole movie. She'd have to sit there through a whole thing and just keep her eyes open. And it's not like that at all, which I appreciated. One of the coolest visual things though in this movie is the use of the lines. There's just constantly these like rows of lines that are being used between like,

[02:00:40:08 - 02:00:52:01]
Speaker 3
 I want to say frescoes, that's not right. But like columns along buildings, it's just used over and over again. I was constantly catching that same like multiple lines thing going on, which I thought was neat.

[02:00:52:01 - 02:00:54:10]
Speaker 2
 Yeah, visually it is a striking, I will say.

[02:00:55:15 - 02:00:58:18]
Speaker 1
 That's Argento's key thing, far and away.

[02:01:00:00 - 02:01:08:08]
Speaker 1
 And the less stylized his movies got, I think that's why they got worse because his story never got a little better.

[02:01:08:08 - 02:01:08:22]
Speaker 2
 Okay.

[02:01:10:09 - 02:01:14:11]
Speaker 1
 Because if you go back, "Bird with Clisipumage," "Deep Red,"

[02:01:15:16 - 02:01:20:09]
Speaker 1
 "Susperia," their style is awesome. Stories are a little better

[02:01:22:01 - 02:01:29:21]
Speaker 1
 than this one. The story's kind of like dropped off a cliff. And then the further along you get into the 90s, like, wow.

[02:01:29:21 - 02:01:34:22]
Speaker 3
 So this is kind of interesting. I'll start going into some of the trivia for this.

[02:01:36:04 - 02:01:49:05]
Speaker 3
 In early 1985, Argento was entrusted by Stethosteo de Massekathera with the production of Guseppe Verdi's "Rigoletto." Sorry.

[02:01:49:05 - 02:01:50:08]
Speaker 2
 I appreciate the accent.

[02:01:50:08 - 02:01:51:14]
Speaker 3
 I'm doing my best here.

[02:01:51:14 - 02:01:53:14]
Speaker 1
 That was a good masking.

[02:01:53:14 - 02:01:55:05]
Speaker 3
 I am not loved by the people of Italy.

[02:01:56:08 - 02:02:28:13]
Speaker 3
 Which was to be Argento's debut as an opera director. Argento's version would have included horrific overtones and gimmicks, such as devices and scenes throughout the theater that would release voltage during the thunderstorm scenes. The theater did not approve of Argento's ideas, leading him to eventually back out of the project. So he kind of had like a huge chip on his shoulder about the theater. And this was sort of a revenge piece. Argento spent two years working on a script for opera.

[02:02:29:20 - 02:02:40:09]
Speaker 3
 Michelle, Michael, so savvy, noted early drafts went beyond the limitations of gore, which in any country, apart from Japan, would have found unacceptable.

[02:02:42:02 - 02:02:42:12]
Speaker 3
 Yeah.

[02:02:43:16 - 02:03:36:05]
Speaker 3
 Development of opera was announced in mid 1986. Argento declared that the film would initially be shot at Teatro Quirano and star Juliana del Sio, who was at the peak of her popularity in Italy following the release of "Let's Hope It's a Girl." Neither plans materialized. And the film was shot in Techo Regio in Parma and the lead being cast by the Spanish actress, Cristina Marcelic. Argento had originally wanted Jennifer Connelly to play the role of Betty in the film, but changed his mind as he didn't want comparisons between this and phenomena. He then attempted to cast Mia Sarrar, the star of "Legend," but changed his mind when fashion designer Giro Armani, Giorgio Armani suggested Marcelic. Sorry.

[02:03:37:11 - 02:03:38:00]
Speaker 3
 Anyway.

[02:03:38:00 - 02:03:43:02]
Speaker 1
 That was a bad choice between those two particular performers as far as acting abilities go.

[02:03:43:02 - 02:03:44:15]
Speaker 3
 I agree. I don't think she was great.

[02:03:44:15 - 02:03:55:05]
Speaker 1
 You mentioned earlier the accents and stuff. The dubbing and stuff is so bad. I'm like, this is sick of telling you. I've looked on the thing to see if there is. And there's not. That's just how-- I did too.

[02:03:55:05 - 02:04:07:17]
Speaker 2
 In fact, I looked it up and it, like there's a Reddit thread about how frustrated people are with this movie and the dubbing in it and that it's dubbed by, I think it's dubbed by the same actors?

[02:04:07:17 - 02:04:26:07]
Speaker 3
 Not all of them. One guy said he was really pissed off because he didn't know that his lines would be dubbed until he saw it and was like, and he actually speaks English. So he was like, what the fuck? He was like, I did kind of wonder why there wasn't a boom mic in the room for the--

[02:04:27:09 - 02:04:28:07]
 (Laughing)

[02:04:28:07 - 02:04:34:18]
Speaker 3
 Which I was like, have you never seen an Argento movie? Have you never seen an Italian movie before? Because--

[02:04:36:10 - 02:04:43:16]
Speaker 1
 To the Phantom thing, I noticed in the opening credits, he's got a credit based on an original idea by

[02:04:43:16 - 02:04:48:07]
Speaker 3
 Tario Argento. Interesting. He's like, fuck you. Fuck you, this is mine.

[02:04:48:07 - 02:04:56:06]
Speaker 2
 That is interesting because, yeah, I was like, oh, okay, I see what he's doing. This is a riff on Phantom of the Opera. No wonder it's called opera.

[02:04:56:06 - 02:05:14:20]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, totally. Yeah, especially with like that opening of like, there's a monstrous person out there and the main singer is being a prima donna. She gets replaced by the understudy who has a beautiful, perfect voice. And he-- The exact story. Loves her. And it's just like, what is going on?

[02:05:14:20 - 02:05:19:04]
Speaker 1
 I mean, after that, it veers and goes to different areas. But that beginning is--

[02:05:19:04 - 02:05:22:16]
Speaker 3
 That up is so, it's exactly how Phantom starts.

[02:05:22:16 - 02:05:24:18]
Speaker 1
 It's another thing about a falling chandelier.

[02:05:24:18 - 02:05:26:00]
Speaker 3
 I know, right?

[02:05:26:00 - 02:05:27:05]
Speaker 1
 Yelling no.

[02:05:27:05 - 02:05:50:01]
Speaker 3
 Filming began in 1987. The film was Argento's most expensive to date at that point. Initially budgeted at 10 million lira, was later reduced to seven, or sorry, 10 billion lira. Okay, I was gonna say 10 million lira, holy shit. Later reduced to seven billion. The scene shot with the Raven's point of view in the theater cost one billion lira on its own.

[02:05:51:19 - 02:06:05:14]
Speaker 3
 On set, Alan Jones reported that opera had been an arduous 15 weeks shoot. Marsala stated she received real burns from the multiple takes she needed during the scene where she was tied up in a chair in a burning room. Jesus.

[02:06:05:14 - 02:06:11:10]
Speaker 1
 It didn't even look good enough. I thought she would have gotten-- I know. You gotta get burned, at least the fire should have looked-- It literally got

[02:06:11:10 - 02:06:17:04]
Speaker 3
 burned in it, man. It was released in Italy in December of 87.

[02:06:19:03 - 02:06:29:09]
Speaker 3
 The US-based Orion Pictures was going to release it, but they truncated almost 30 minutes of footage, including the ending and the Swiss Alps.

[02:06:30:18 - 02:06:41:21]
Speaker 3
 They ultimately scrapped the theatrical release in America altogether. And it failed a theatrical release in the United Kingdom, but it was a box at Office Success in Italy

[02:06:42:22 - 02:06:51:16]
Speaker 3
 where it grossed 4,737 million lira. I don't understand how this grossed a bunch of money in there. Anyway, it's fine.

[02:06:52:18 - 02:06:56:20]
Speaker 1
 Dario's freakishly popular in Italy, or at least he was at the time. Like front

[02:06:58:08 - 02:07:01:08]
Speaker 1
 page of the news, Dario's making a new movie.

[02:07:01:08 - 02:07:02:10]
Speaker 3
 Oh, interesting.

[02:07:02:10 - 02:07:03:16]
Speaker 1
 He was just huge.

[02:07:03:16 - 02:07:18:04]
Speaker 3
 The idea of the pins under the eyes torture device came from a joke of Argento's. He said it would annoy him when people would look away during scary scenes in his films. He would jokingly suggest taping pins under people's eyes so they couldn't look away from the film. What a funny guy.

[02:07:20:02 - 02:07:37:16]
Speaker 3
 According to star Urbado, Barbara Nini, it would take hours for everyone to recapture the ravens after they were released in the opera house for the filming. Around 140 ravens were used, but only 60 some were ever retrieved. The others apparently escaped from the opera house during filming,

[02:07:38:17 - 02:08:32:04]
Speaker 3
 which is great. Many mishaps on set, including the death of one of the actors, led director Dario Argento to believe that the Macbeth curse had also struck during the making of his movie. Though I don't know if that means, like if he met the guy with AIDS, or if he met something, I don't know. I couldn't figure out what they were talking about. And then Daria, Nicole, originally did not want to play the role of Mira, his lady friend. She felt the character was thinly written and in addition had ended her long-term relationship with Dario Argento two years earlier, would finally convinced her to take the role was the fact that she loved Mira's elaborate and shocking death scene. She would later say that filming her death scene was tremendously scary as it required her to have a small amount of explosives placed on the back of her head. Eesh. Eesh. Cool. Yeah. So that's all my notes. So Kelly, did you like it at all?

[02:08:32:04 - 02:08:45:04]
Speaker 2
 I liked the visuals of it. But there was nothing in here that made me go, "Oh, I have been completely wrong about Italian horror."

[02:08:45:04 - 02:08:45:23]
Speaker 5
 Yeah.

[02:08:47:02 - 02:08:51:19]
Speaker 2
 It just made me question everybody who loves these kind of movies. I'm like, there's

[02:08:52:23 - 02:08:53:08]
Speaker 2
 not,

[02:08:56:05 - 02:09:03:17]
Speaker 2
 there's not the kind of filmmaking that I like going on in these movies, which is strong writing and,

[02:09:05:12 - 02:09:14:09]
Speaker 2
 like I said, it's striking looking, but some of the photography was so bad that I was like, this clearly required a second take.

[02:09:15:22 - 02:09:15:23]
 (Both Laughing)

[02:09:15:23 - 02:09:17:06]
Speaker 3
 And did not get it.

[02:09:17:06 - 02:09:22:08]
Speaker 1
 Now, I think I leaned a little bit into Dario. And again, it's more from his earlier stuff.

[02:09:24:13 - 02:09:29:03]
Speaker 1
 Like a friend recently say that Dario is making new movies and I go, okay.

[02:09:29:03 - 02:09:29:18]
Speaker 4
 Yeah.

[02:09:29:18 - 02:09:44:01]
Speaker 1
 But this style over substance is part of what I liked about him. I also saw opera. This is one of those I should have left in the, I saw it and liked it when I was much younger. And it was one of the first

[02:09:45:18 - 02:09:59:23]
Speaker 1
 batshit crazy Italian movies like this I'd ever seen. So I was like, whoa. And that one scene of violence just stuck with me so strongly that it painted the whole film. Yeah, that was impressive. Yeah, so that was my memory of it.

[02:10:02:20 - 02:10:08:06]
Speaker 1
 I'm fine owning it. I like it enough that it's kind of interesting just for the Dario aspect of it.

[02:10:09:06 - 02:10:11:23]
Speaker 1
 But yeah, this is definitely where he

[02:10:13:18 - 02:10:23:08]
Speaker 1
 started to show his weaker stuff coming out a little too much. I think he's probably a little too in love with his filmic abilities by this time.

[02:10:23:08 - 02:10:30:13]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, it does feel like there was ego getting in the way of creating something really powerful in here.

[02:10:30:13 - 02:10:33:21]
Speaker 1
 And what was with the gloves? Had plastic gloves over them?

[02:10:33:21 - 02:10:40:20]
Speaker 3
 Oh yeah. Did you notice that? He was releasing them. He was taking off the plastic over his gloves to ensure that he would get in the way with it or something.

[02:10:40:20 - 02:10:46:00]
Speaker 1
 It's like, okay, those gloves leave fingerprints that I don't know about either.

[02:10:46:00 - 02:10:48:10]
Speaker 3
 I didn't even think about that. You're so right.

[02:10:48:10 - 02:10:53:15]
Speaker 1
 It's fine, but it definitely dropped, in my opinion, quite a bit from what it used to be.

[02:10:53:15 - 02:10:55:18]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, I didn't understand the, like,

[02:10:56:20 - 02:11:30:09]
Speaker 3
 hey, here's this high, high tense action scene that's like the end of the movie. And then, okay, now we're off in Swiss Alps, but this is really the ending. And I was like, what is happening? I think that there's cool stuff going on in it, but I'm a little bit more with Kelly. I really like strong storytelling. So I think I can appreciate the visuals. I'm glad that there are really strong visuals in there. But if I want to watch something super bat shit, Crazy Italian, I will go for Phenomena over and over again because you cannot beat a monkey with a razor blade.

[02:11:30:09 - 02:11:38:05]
Speaker 1
 I like that. I like that movie. Yeah, I like Phenomena more. I like Suspiria more, Deep Red, Bird of the Crystal Plumage. I think all have more to offer.

[02:11:38:05 - 02:11:53:05]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, Deep Red's really cool. Yeah, Suspiria, I always found kind of funny too because it is visually really crazy and the music is insane, but I was always like, everyone loves this movie. What am I missing? Like what is happening here?

[02:11:53:05 - 02:12:04:04]
Speaker 1
 Suspiria more for me is literally almost just the first 20 to 30 minutes. It's just holy shit. And there's a lot of cool stuff after that, but yeah, this is a really strange story.

[02:12:04:04 - 02:12:11:00]
Speaker 3
 There's like a lot of like talking to like teachers and like, we're gonna gossip in our bedroom. Like, okay.

[02:12:12:20 - 02:12:23:23]
Speaker 2
 Well, I'm glad that I can cross it off the list. It turns out, Bava is my Italian guy for whatever reason. Argento is just not doing it for me.

[02:12:25:18 - 02:12:35:07]
Speaker 2
 Okay, so that means it is my choice for the next film. And I'm gonna pitch something different because I'm trying to keep this interesting for me and you.

[02:12:36:19 - 02:12:37:13]
Speaker 2
 For me and you.

[02:12:40:05 - 02:12:51:19]
Speaker 2
 How about we do a marathon of a franchise and each one of us then gets stuck with the next movie in it. And I'm going to suggest

[02:12:53:01 - 02:12:54:08]
Speaker 2
 a Mad Max-a-thon.

[02:12:54:08 - 02:12:57:09]
Speaker 3
 All right, yes. I can do a Mad Max-a-thon.

[02:12:57:09 - 02:12:59:12]
Speaker 1
 Crazy ass actor, let's do it.

[02:12:59:12 - 02:13:01:23]
Speaker 3
 How far are we going through the Mad Max catalog?

[02:13:01:23 - 02:13:03:19]
Speaker 2
 All of them, there's five movies.

[02:13:03:19 - 02:13:05:02]
Speaker 5
 All right.

[02:13:05:02 - 02:13:13:01]
Speaker 2
 And if you wanna play the game or read the comics or whatever and then insert those in somewhere, I would be happy to hear about it.

[02:13:13:01 - 02:13:18:01]
Speaker 3
 That would be so fun. I don't think I have time to play the game. I've been wanting to forever, but that's okay.

[02:13:18:01 - 02:13:24:17]
Speaker 2
 So, okay, that means then that next week or next episode, we are starting with Mad Max.

[02:13:24:17 - 02:13:25:15]
Speaker 3
 Excellent, cool.

[02:13:25:15 - 02:14:12:16]
Speaker 2
 All right, guys, this is the part where we say thanks to everybody out there who's liking and sharing posts, who's commenting on the YouTube video and who's sending donations our way. It's called Value for Value. And it's literally the only way I'm stopping these greedy bastards from starting a Patreon. So if you- There you go. If you like the- We may still start a Patreon some of you guys. You just never know. If you like the fun commercials that Eric is putting in the middle of our thing, that's because you guys donate money. Otherwise you're gonna start getting fucking commercials for HIMSS and Mattress City and all the other shitty commercials you get in your podcast. We don't have them because you guys are sending money. I mean, not lately, but in theory.

[02:14:12:16 - 02:14:30:16]
Speaker 3
 In theory, and we appreciate it every time you do. In addition to donating money, you can also give us a call and say, "Hey, what's up?" Or even text us on the Strange Eons Radio Hotline and that number is 253-237-4266. We would love to hear from you.

[02:14:30:16 - 02:14:31:22]
Speaker 2
 Eric is standing by.

[02:14:31:22 - 02:14:34:10]
Speaker 3
 Eric is ready, day or night. Gimme.

[02:14:36:02 - 02:14:44:15]
Speaker 2
 All right, gang, this was a blast. Thanks for coming all the way up here. And we'll be back in two short weeks about Mad Max. See you next time.

[02:14:46:18 - 02:15:15:01]
Speaker 2
 Okay, turn off. Transportation and other considerations for Strange Eons Radio produced by Pan Am Airlines. When you think of traveling, think of Pan Am. You can't beat the experience. Yes, the Strange Eons Radio stay at Econolodge, Everett. It's an easy stop on the road, you know what I mean? Strange Eons Radio is recorded live in front of a studio audience. If you enjoyed this episode, please consider leaving us a positive review on your favorite podcast set. Sit, Ubu, sit.

[02:15:15:01 - 02:15:18:14]
Speaker 3
 Yeah, I think I'm gonna skip this one. It's not worth it.